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The Discipline Expert24 August 2023

The Discipline Expert: The 4 Surprising & Easy Habits ALL High Achievers Have! (Based On 2,000 Years Of Research) - Ryan Holiday

10Frameworks
11Insights

Frameworks in this episode

Insights & moments

The myth-busts, hot takes, explainers, and tools worth keeping.

Myth Buster· 1

Myth Buster40:00

Meditations Should Be Unreadable Today, and Somehow Isn't

Holiday makes the case that on its face, Meditations should be inaccessible, impractical and incomprehensible. Its author was the most powerful man on Earth, emperor of Rome, literally worshipped as a god, head of the most powerful army, steeped in philosophy and rhetoric, writing in Greek to himself, probably in a tent on the front lines, never intending publication and likely mortified that it happened. The notes are so specific that many of them are now unintelligible, referencing a toll operator in some province or a remark by an unnamed person. His conclusion is that the most specific book imaginable turned out timeless and universal, because as strange as Marcus's life was, it is fundamentally not that different from ours.

  • Written in Greek, privately, probably on a battlefield, with no intended reader
  • Marcus would likely be mortified that it was ever published
  • Many entries are so specific that their meaning is now lost entirely
  • Holiday's point: maximum specificity produced maximum universality
  • People have had substantially the same problems for two thousand years

on its face Marcus realizes meditations should be inaccessible impractical incomprehensible

Ryan Holiday · 40:00

somehow it is timeless and Universal because as different and strange and surreal as his life and experiences it's fundamentally not that different than yours…

Ryan Holiday · 41:00
#marcus-aurelius#meditations#philosophy#writing#universality

Hot Take· 2

Hot Take50:30

Holiday Doesn't Know His Own Twitter Password, on Purpose

Holiday describes social platforms as manufacturing conflict people would never have sought out otherwise: if they had not seen the tweet it would not have bothered them, but they picked up the phone during dinner, during work or while with their kids, and the feed serves up whatever outrages them because outrage is what gets engagement. They then cannot resume their life until they have informed a stranger they have never met that the stranger is wrong. He asks whether anyone has ever spent five seconds or fifty minutes on an app and thought it was a great use of their time. His own solution is structural: the apps are not on his phone and he does not know the passwords to either his personal or Daily Stoic Twitter accounts, so anything he needs to say goes through someone who works for him.

  • Outrage is served because outrage is what gets engagement
  • The conflict is voluntarily sought; without the feed it would not exist
  • It interrupts dinner, work and time with children, and blocks return until answered
  • You always feel slightly guilty afterwards and the time went faster than you thought
  • Holiday's fix is structural: no apps on the phone, no knowledge of the passwords

you just watch people voluntarily seek out conflict and things to be upset about like if they didn't see the tweet it wouldn't bother them

Ryan Holiday · 51:00

I don't know the password to the Daily stoic or my personal Twitter account

Ryan Holiday · 53:00
#social-media#attention#boundaries#outrage#digital-hygiene
Hot Take1:20:30

On ChatGPT: The Upside-Down Urinal Is Art Because Someone Decided It Was

Asked whether large language models threaten writers, Holiday reports actually testing it: he asked ChatGPT to write Daily Stoic emails on the subjects of change and of replaceability. It did okay, not as good as his own work, and he still had to edit and refine it. His argument is that intentionality remains the main thing, using Duchamp's urinal as the case: it is art because someone decided to turn a urinal upside down and declare it so. The refining, polishing and changing is the role of the human. He compares it to Google Books, when authors insisted searching text was not the same as finding it physically in a library and continued working the old way, while younger people took the time savings and did more.

  • Holiday actually ran the test: two Daily Stoic emails written by ChatGPT
  • The output was okay but required his editing and refinement
  • Having the idea to do it at all was still his contribution
  • The urinal is art because someone decided it was; intentionality is the main thing
  • Google Books precedent: the holdouts kept working the old way while others gained the time

the upside down urinal is Art because someone decided to put a urinal upside down and said that is Art and so you know the…

Ryan Holiday · 1:21:30

the job of uh of each of us is to figure out how to use it and not be used by it

Ryan Holiday · 1:22:30
#artificial-intelligence#chatgpt#writing#technology#creativity

Explainer· 3

Explainer31:00

The Wilderness Years: Where Churchill Said Psychic Dynamite Is Made

Holiday argues that almost every great leader, athlete and philosopher has been through something, and reaches for Churchill's account of it. Churchill said that every prophet and great person is of society but then sent into the wilderness: a period where their work is unpopular, their ideas are rejected, they struggle to make ends meet, or a controversy engulfs them. Churchill himself spent roughly 1933 to 1939 out of public life as persona non grata, and described the wilderness as where psychic dynamite is made. Holiday's mechanism is that not having everyone listen, not getting what you want, and not having everything at the push of a button forces you to refine what you think and to grow, change and adapt.

  • Churchill's wilderness ran roughly 1933 to 1939, out of public life as persona non grata
  • His phrase for what the wilderness produces is psychic dynamite
  • Steve Jobs's wilderness is being fired from the company he founded
  • The mechanism is friction: not being listened to forces refinement of what you actually think
  • The return brings greater purpose, clarity and skill to whatever you do next

Churchill spends like 33 to 39 basically out of public life sort of persona non grata and he says that it's in this Wilderness he…

Ryan Holiday · 31:30

there's an ego death in losing being rejected realizing you're not what you thought you were

Ryan Holiday · 32:30
#adversity#churchill#steve-jobs#ego#resilience
Explainer35:30

Why Holiday Writes First and Everything Else Second

Asked about the non-obvious upsides of writing, Holiday says nothing clarifies what you think like the exercise of writing it down. He cites Amazon, where launching a project, proposing a change or calling a meeting requires a written agenda, sometimes a press release for the thing being proposed, and a written pitch, and argues the value is less the communication than being forced to work out what you think, why, and where the contradictions are. He notes that enthusiasm carries a book about ten pages before structure becomes mandatory: you have to have solved the whole thing before you can write it, and stream-of-consciousness does not work. He makes content in every other medium but writes the ideas first, with everything else broken out of the books.

  • Amazon requires written memos, agendas and even press releases before a project or meeting
  • The purpose is forcing the thinker to find the contradictions, not informing the reader
  • Enthusiasm gets you about ten pages into a book before structure is required
  • Holiday writes the ideas first; TikTok, Instagram and articles are broken out of the books
  • Instant high-res shareable video is easy, and the ease is the trap; writing stays hard

nothing clarifies what you think quite like practice or the exercise of writing something down

Ryan Holiday · 36:00

the ease of that is almost the Trap right writing is is hard and always will be hard and maybe that's why it's good

Ryan Holiday · 39:00
#writing#thinking#amazon#content-strategy#creative-process
Explainer55:30

Walks and Water: The 20,000-Year-Old Footprints Argument

Holiday's second theme of the good life is that there is something magical about water and about long walks, where he finds peace, inspiration, calmness and stillness. His framing is careful: he is not claiming a walk solves your problems, only that there are very few problems made worse by taking one, and the same goes for jumping in a pool or the ocean. His evidence is evolutionary. Some of the oldest evidence of human beings in America is a set of footprints at what is now White Sands, New Mexico, left roughly 20,000 years ago by a mother repeatedly carrying and setting down a child. Walking is what humans have done for as long as there have been humans, and the rhythm of it slows you down, forces thought and makes you present.

  • Very few problems are made worse by taking a walk
  • The White Sands footprints in New Mexico date back around 20,000 years
  • They record a mother carrying and setting down a child, repeatedly, over distance
  • The rhythm and movement slow you down and make you present
  • Every religious tradition and zen garden includes water or a fountain for a reason

I'm not saying that taking a walk will solve all of your problems I'm just saying that there's very few problems that are made worse…

Ryan Holiday · 56:00

there's something about the rhythm of it the movement of it that slows us down forces us to think makes us very present

Ryan Holiday · 56:30
#walking#creativity#stillness#evolution#daily-rituals

Story· 4

Story6:00

Marcus Aurelius Made His Stepbrother Co-Emperor on Day One

Holiday tells the story of the first thing Marcus Aurelius did with unlimited power: he gave half of it away. He named Lucius Verus, a stepbrother with no blood relation and almost opposite character, as co-emperor. In Meditations, Marcus never calls him a stepbrother, only his brother, and writes at length about being grateful to have had in his life a man whose character helped him improve his own. Holiday's reading is that Marcus had to practise acceptance, flexibility and meeting people where they are, finding the good in someone rather than trying to remake him or become disappointed and judgemental about the differences.

  • Marcus's first act as emperor was to hand half his power to a man with no claim to it
  • Lucius Verus was about as different from Marcus as a person could be
  • In Meditations, Marcus drops the qualifier and simply calls him his brother
  • The Stoic move was adjusting himself to Lucius rather than forcing Lucius to become like him
  • Holiday treats this as the harder, higher form of discipline: flexibility rather than rigidity

the first thing he does with unlimited power is he gives half of it away to someone with an almost opposite

Ryan Holiday · 6:30

I'm so grateful to have had this person in my life a man whose character helped me improve my own

Ryan Holiday · 7:00
#stoicism#marcus-aurelius#leadership#power#relationships
Story25:30

Bartlett's Best-Performing Quote Broke Every Rule He Believed About Quotes

Bartlett describes writing his highest-performing quote ever after an argument with his girlfriend about him working too much: that in a relationship, he wants to be your second priority and wants your first priority to be you. He notes it violated all his preconceptions about what makes a good quote, the pattern, the rhythm, the syllabics, and came instead from having had a genuinely bad day. Holiday agrees the experience is humbling, and adds the harder half: things he knows are not good have done extremely well, and things he is deeply proud of have flopped. His conclusion is that you cannot trade your definition of good for the verdict of a fickle algorithm.

  • The quote came out of a real argument, not a technique
  • It broke every rule Bartlett held about rhythm and structure in quotes
  • Holiday's mirror case: work he is proud of has repeatedly underperformed
  • The pattern is not random, but it is not a signal about quality either
  • Letting reception define your standard means someone else decides whether you are good

if we're in a relationship I want to be your second priority I want your first priority to be you

Steven Bartlett · 26:00

am I gonna trade my definition of what's good or not good based on this fickle algorithm or Randomness or whatever no

Ryan Holiday · 26:30
#content-creation#algorithms#craft#self-evaluation
Story38:00

366 Entries in One Sitting, Then Eight Years Without Stopping

Holiday wrote The Daily Stoic in 2015 as a one-page-a-day book, producing all 366 entries in one sitting. On the day he finished it, he decided simply to keep going, publishing one entry a day by email and podcast, which he has now done every day for eight years. He is direct about where the value landed: the process of having to produce, polish, edit, work on, read and record one thing every single day is what transformed his understanding of Stoicism and him as a person. The millions of readers and listeners are almost incidental to that, and he says the process would have transformed his life even if none of it had ever been published.

  • The Daily Stoic was written in 2015, all 366 entries produced in one sitting
  • He chose to continue the day the book was finished, and has published daily for eight years
  • The transformation came from the daily production loop, not from the audience
  • He had already written books about Stoicism before; the daily practice is what deepened it
  • He states it plainly: even unpublished, the process would have transformed his life

so I wrote 366 in one sitting and then the day I finished the book I said I'm just gonna keep going

Ryan Holiday · 38:00

even if it was never published that process would have transformed my life

Ryan Holiday · 39:00
#daily-practice#writing#consistency#stoicism
Story1:12:00

The Play Only Got Three Acts: Marcus Aurelius's Last Words

Asked what he would say to the entire world from his deathbed, Holiday reaches for Marcus Aurelius. The last words in Meditations address the man himself: this is the play, it only got three acts, the curtain is coming down, did you do a good job? In life, probably dying of the plague with his friends weeping around him, Marcus asked them what they were crying about and told them not to think about him but about their own lives and what they could do with the time they had left. Holiday's own version follows from it: one of the few ways the dead go on improving us is by reminding us, through their absence, that the same will be true of us. None of us get forever, the song ends, and the fact you get tomorrow when someone else does not is a gift.

  • Marcus's closing lines in Meditations are addressed to himself, not to a reader
  • The image is a three-act play with the curtain descending
  • Dying, probably of plague, he redirected his weeping friends to their own remaining time
  • The dead keep helping us by reminding us of our own finitude
  • Getting tomorrow when someone else did not is a gift not to be taken for granted

hey man this is the play it only got three acts curtains coming down did you do a good job

Ryan Holiday · 1:12:30

none of us get forever the song ends at some point and so what did you um what did you do with the time that…

Ryan Holiday · 1:13:30
#mortality#marcus-aurelius#grief#legacy#memento-mori

Takeaway· 1

Takeaway58:30

We Are Made for Each Other: Contribution as the Meaning of Life

Holiday's fourth theme is that meaning comes from serving or contributing to the common good, a phrase Marcus Aurelius uses perhaps forty or fifty times in Meditations. Marcus's position is that we are put here for other people and our job is to help others and to leave the place better than we found it. Holiday states flatly that this is the meaning of life, and reframes the deathbed question accordingly: not how much money you made or what records you broke, but what contribution you made to the collective and what legacy you are leaving. He goes further than aspiration, calling service not merely a source of meaning and purpose but an obligation of being human.

  • Marcus references the common good roughly forty to fifty times in Meditations
  • The Stoic position is that we are put here for other people
  • The measure is contribution and legacy, not money or records
  • Holiday calls it the meaning of life without hedging
  • He frames service as an obligation of being human, not an optional virtue

we're put here for other people um our job is to is to help others to you know leave this place better than you've like…

Ryan Holiday · 59:00

what is the What is the contribution you are making to the collective that's meaning and purpose and quite frankly your obligation as a human…

Ryan Holiday · 59:30
#meaning#service#legacy#stoicism#purpose